Who has the Worst Memory?
Article submitted by Danny Foster
So then, who has the worst memory? Spurs fans or a goldfish? You decide.
I know that yet again it's only a minority of the fans that are calling for the managers head and that every club has them, but it just seems our minority is slightly larger than any other club's, and although it's still only a minority, it's becoming evermore apparent that there is only a small difference between the minority and the majority.
Don't worry yourself if you're confused by my above statement as it's probably my fault; with everything that is flying around about BMJ (Big Martin Jol), I'm actually beginning to struggling with words, let alone sentences and paragraphs so bare with me.
There really are Spurs fans that want Jol sacked. What are you on? My level of frustration has gone through the roof. Do people not understand that no matter who takes over, it will take years to break the top four? Manchester United, Liverpool and Arsenal have a ten year head start on us. And as for Chelsea, we know that their billions have helped them enter that bracket.
Maybe this is the reason why no one likes us. Why do we have the right to be there? Aren't there another fifteen teams in the league? Just because we spent a lot of money, it doesn't mean we are now a better team than those that were above us previously, for several reasons, but I'll just pick a few.
A) These teams were above us last season for a reason; they had a better team. Therefore, the first few improvements are just the catch up signings with the other additions maybe taking us beyond them.
B) Further additions may not take us beyond them because unfortunately, we're not the only team allowed to strengthen in the transfer windows (I know, don't worry, I'll be writing to the FA to find out why this is), therefore it makes it even harder to catch up.
C) The head start these teams already have on us as a unit. And I don't just mean the playing staff. I am talking about the coaching staff, the backroom staff, and everything about the structure of these clubs is in place. These clubs work in an orderly fashion, like clockwork, well almost.
D) Also we can't attract the quality that Arsenal can because we can only offer a UEFA Cup run.
There could be a whole alphabet of reasons so I'll stop there for now.
No matter who takes over these facts won't change. Jol said at the commencement of his Spurs career that he had a five year plan to make us a top four team. When he made that bold statement, I nearly choked on my Cornflakes. Even then I thought if he does it in five years he's a miracle worker; he very nearly accomplished it the next bloody season!
Did you know that on average, we've finished just four and a half points behind Arsenal in the last two years? If someone told me we'd close the gap that much in such a short period I'd have been ecstatic.
This minority claim that Jol's isn't the man to take us any further? Why? How do you know that without letting him try? We were all so happy to give him five years to do it in when he took over, but now he's taken us this far, it isn’t far enough?
Remember, it was about this far into his managerial career at Manchester United that the fans were trying to get Sir Alex Ferguson sacked. This just shows how little us fans actually know about football. I truly believe that the 'Jol Out Brigade' are just as wrong.
People question his substitutions and tactics. How can you? Unless you've played the game professionally, you know nothing about football! I don't understand half the stuff Mourinho does, but it works, and to say it doesn't for Jol is ridiculous.
As far as I'm concerned, he's the 5th best tactician in the league. I know he's got more quality to work with than say Portsmouth, but he didn't when he took over.
The perfect example is when Jol played Keane on the left wing against Chelsea in November 2006. He tore them to bits and we beat them for the first time that I can remember in the league. In our game after the Chealsea win, Jol used the same formation/tactics against reading, it didn't work, and so he tried to change it but it was too late. And what did we get after the game? Sites full of people slating his tactics! They deemed the tactics he used three days before against Chelsea as brilliant, but didn't like the way the team performed in the next match.
We all know nothing about football at this level. We don't know what job he's asked the players to do and as fans we look too deeply into things we really have no understanding of.
Let's look at the things we do understand. Martin Jol takes over; we just miss out on Europe. In the next season, we do badly in the cups, but finish 5th (the first time we've qualified for Europe via the league in twenty years). Next season, we participate in two cup quarter finals, one semi-final, and finish 5th again (the second time in twenty years we've qualified for Europe via the league).
So I ask you to think long and hard about this next question; Is that not progress in every season he's been with us?
If you do think it's progress, why do you find it so hard to believe he can progress again?
Too many people keep saying we're showing blind faith in Jol. The evidence is not blind. Since Jol has been at the helm, we've done nothing but go FORWARD under his guidance. Please tell me how that is BLIND faith? Where’s your evidence that he’s not the man to take us forward?
Do you agree with the way he's achieved what he has? The tactics he's used? I personally do. We were the 3rd highest goal scorers in the Premier League last season; yeah we conceded a few, but we were missing King, and more importantly, it's what we asked for; attractive, attacking football. No one complains about the goals Brazil concede. Maybe we should be more careful with what we wish for?
Jol intentionally went against his own footballing principles (which were obviously a bit more negative when he first took over) to create a team the fans wanted. He came out several times to comment on the type of football Spurs fans expect and tried to make a successful team that played that way. This fact on it's own makes his job harder, but he did it for us, the fans.
Would you rather win more but play how Chelsea play? I personally wouldn't. I'd rather get the attacking football right a la Manchester United last year. Maybe if we didn't force this attractive football on him, he may well have moulded a more defensive team together and won us some trophies, but he didn't, and that's down to us, not him!
And let me tell you something, a team doesn't do well IN SPITE of the manager, if a team is badly managed, it does badly.. simple really.
Do you remember pre-Jol? Now look where we are! All we've done is progress under his guidance, yet some people think he's not good enough. We want Juande Ramos, the manager of the team we lost to last year due to two bad penalty decisions and not due to the tactics he employed during the game?
If it wasn't for those two ridiculous decisions, we could well have won the UEFA Cup. Would I be writing this now if we had?
I think not.
Ramos is a manager that has done nothing for twenty years, but has had success in the past two seasons. Jol has vastly improved teams he has been with in Holland and now England.
Remember, were it not for Carlos Queiroz coming back from Spain, Jol would actually have been the assistant at Manchester United. Ferguson is no mug. I am however, starting to think that Levy and some of our supporters are though. I have always thought Kelmsley was!
So I ask you; who has the shorter memory; a goldfish or Spurs fans?
So then, who has the worst memory? Spurs fans or a goldfish? You decide.
I know that yet again it's only a minority of the fans that are calling for the managers head and that every club has them, but it just seems our minority is slightly larger than any other club's, and although it's still only a minority, it's becoming evermore apparent that there is only a small difference between the minority and the majority.
Don't worry yourself if you're confused by my above statement as it's probably my fault; with everything that is flying around about BMJ (Big Martin Jol), I'm actually beginning to struggling with words, let alone sentences and paragraphs so bare with me.
There really are Spurs fans that want Jol sacked. What are you on? My level of frustration has gone through the roof. Do people not understand that no matter who takes over, it will take years to break the top four? Manchester United, Liverpool and Arsenal have a ten year head start on us. And as for Chelsea, we know that their billions have helped them enter that bracket.
Maybe this is the reason why no one likes us. Why do we have the right to be there? Aren't there another fifteen teams in the league? Just because we spent a lot of money, it doesn't mean we are now a better team than those that were above us previously, for several reasons, but I'll just pick a few.
A) These teams were above us last season for a reason; they had a better team. Therefore, the first few improvements are just the catch up signings with the other additions maybe taking us beyond them.
B) Further additions may not take us beyond them because unfortunately, we're not the only team allowed to strengthen in the transfer windows (I know, don't worry, I'll be writing to the FA to find out why this is), therefore it makes it even harder to catch up.
C) The head start these teams already have on us as a unit. And I don't just mean the playing staff. I am talking about the coaching staff, the backroom staff, and everything about the structure of these clubs is in place. These clubs work in an orderly fashion, like clockwork, well almost.
D) Also we can't attract the quality that Arsenal can because we can only offer a UEFA Cup run.
There could be a whole alphabet of reasons so I'll stop there for now.
No matter who takes over these facts won't change. Jol said at the commencement of his Spurs career that he had a five year plan to make us a top four team. When he made that bold statement, I nearly choked on my Cornflakes. Even then I thought if he does it in five years he's a miracle worker; he very nearly accomplished it the next bloody season!
Did you know that on average, we've finished just four and a half points behind Arsenal in the last two years? If someone told me we'd close the gap that much in such a short period I'd have been ecstatic.
This minority claim that Jol's isn't the man to take us any further? Why? How do you know that without letting him try? We were all so happy to give him five years to do it in when he took over, but now he's taken us this far, it isn’t far enough?
Remember, it was about this far into his managerial career at Manchester United that the fans were trying to get Sir Alex Ferguson sacked. This just shows how little us fans actually know about football. I truly believe that the 'Jol Out Brigade' are just as wrong.
People question his substitutions and tactics. How can you? Unless you've played the game professionally, you know nothing about football! I don't understand half the stuff Mourinho does, but it works, and to say it doesn't for Jol is ridiculous.
As far as I'm concerned, he's the 5th best tactician in the league. I know he's got more quality to work with than say Portsmouth, but he didn't when he took over.
The perfect example is when Jol played Keane on the left wing against Chelsea in November 2006. He tore them to bits and we beat them for the first time that I can remember in the league. In our game after the Chealsea win, Jol used the same formation/tactics against reading, it didn't work, and so he tried to change it but it was too late. And what did we get after the game? Sites full of people slating his tactics! They deemed the tactics he used three days before against Chelsea as brilliant, but didn't like the way the team performed in the next match.
We all know nothing about football at this level. We don't know what job he's asked the players to do and as fans we look too deeply into things we really have no understanding of.
Let's look at the things we do understand. Martin Jol takes over; we just miss out on Europe. In the next season, we do badly in the cups, but finish 5th (the first time we've qualified for Europe via the league in twenty years). Next season, we participate in two cup quarter finals, one semi-final, and finish 5th again (the second time in twenty years we've qualified for Europe via the league).
So I ask you to think long and hard about this next question; Is that not progress in every season he's been with us?
If you do think it's progress, why do you find it so hard to believe he can progress again?
Too many people keep saying we're showing blind faith in Jol. The evidence is not blind. Since Jol has been at the helm, we've done nothing but go FORWARD under his guidance. Please tell me how that is BLIND faith? Where’s your evidence that he’s not the man to take us forward?
Do you agree with the way he's achieved what he has? The tactics he's used? I personally do. We were the 3rd highest goal scorers in the Premier League last season; yeah we conceded a few, but we were missing King, and more importantly, it's what we asked for; attractive, attacking football. No one complains about the goals Brazil concede. Maybe we should be more careful with what we wish for?
Jol intentionally went against his own footballing principles (which were obviously a bit more negative when he first took over) to create a team the fans wanted. He came out several times to comment on the type of football Spurs fans expect and tried to make a successful team that played that way. This fact on it's own makes his job harder, but he did it for us, the fans.
Would you rather win more but play how Chelsea play? I personally wouldn't. I'd rather get the attacking football right a la Manchester United last year. Maybe if we didn't force this attractive football on him, he may well have moulded a more defensive team together and won us some trophies, but he didn't, and that's down to us, not him!
And let me tell you something, a team doesn't do well IN SPITE of the manager, if a team is badly managed, it does badly.. simple really.
Do you remember pre-Jol? Now look where we are! All we've done is progress under his guidance, yet some people think he's not good enough. We want Juande Ramos, the manager of the team we lost to last year due to two bad penalty decisions and not due to the tactics he employed during the game?
If it wasn't for those two ridiculous decisions, we could well have won the UEFA Cup. Would I be writing this now if we had?
I think not.
Ramos is a manager that has done nothing for twenty years, but has had success in the past two seasons. Jol has vastly improved teams he has been with in Holland and now England.
Remember, were it not for Carlos Queiroz coming back from Spain, Jol would actually have been the assistant at Manchester United. Ferguson is no mug. I am however, starting to think that Levy and some of our supporters are though. I have always thought Kelmsley was!
So I ask you; who has the shorter memory; a goldfish or Spurs fans?
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43 comments
Fastuna Aspirlla rides again
Nice article Dan Mac ,your spot on cant agree more,I was driving home from the game on Saturday,and either on 606 or Talkshit was a alleged spurs fan saying that we should get hoddle back,as he was the best wed had !!!!!!!!! i nearly crashed the car.
Danny, i'm not ashamed to admit that i kind of love you now.
GR
I belive that Jol will take Spurs forward, unfortunately I don't think he will be around to so after the board's backstabbing.
Just out of interest though - when does Jol pass his sell by date ?
Do we go another two years of finishing top 6 before we expect European Championship football, or should changes be made at the end of this year ?
I'm sorry, but are you are trying to say these teams are badly managed?!?!? If so, you just made yourself look like a tit.
Either that, or you totally misunderstood the point and just made yourself look like a tit.
Wenger has lacked the serious wedge required to push Arsenal on from 2005. He knew that team was finished, notealy Cole, Campbell, Vieira, Pires and Bergkamp. How do you replace players who one of the best in the world in their position on the cheap? You can't.
And so Wenger has had to to take 3 or 4 steps back in order to make one step forward. We've been making a net profit on transfer dealings in the past 3 years! Not the sort of thing you associate with even medium sized clubs, least of all the 13 times Champions of England.
In the meantime, Jol has spent £100m - about £45m net. What's he done with it? Do you get a trophy for 5th place? Do you get trophies for semi-final/quarter-final appearances?
The Spurs board have backed Jol handsomely. If you had Wenger instead of Jol, you'd be challenging Man Utd and Chelsea. Instead, you're bat…
To people who constantly ask if Jols hould have the season to get it right, before all this Ramos business I'd of said he should be in charge for at least this season and next, whatever happens this season. Not sacking him if he doesn't make CL this season. Because then the problem is any manager who comes in has to get instant CL football or in two years at the most or they have to go, because if Jol isn't given a decent period of time, then nobody should get it.
Just because I used you as an example (simply because you're the closest of the top 4 to us) don't for one minute think this article was in anyway about Arsenal!
About bloody time THBN
If the article is appropriate and 400 words or less, it will be deemed for consideration.
Regards
THBN
Colin, Herts
1. Martin Jol has more dignity and honour than ANY Spurs manager since Burkinshaw.
2. People who play Championship manager generally know nothing about the real world of football.
3. Paul Kemsley is a trustworthy as a Peado in a swimming pool.
I was going to put something about the 3-year olds logged into VitalFootball but it was too obvious.
The problem is now that we will go one way or the other - Manure may get a backlash from us if the players rally to protect the manager - the other side of that coin is the obvious - we choke at manure/the filth and then who are we to blame. Fortunately for Jol now he can say that all this crap coming from the dove from above has had it's impact on the players and guess what - we lost both of those games down to Levy. I spoke with a director of the club (paul Barber) very recently and TBH - I just get the distinct impression that these people do not give a hoot about us, hear stories of them issueing rumours that Jol wnats to sell Berbs - and thats why they want him out - this is very underhand if true and although I love my club, own a stake in it (and have profitted nicely - on paper anyway) I cannot abide the tactics deployed and being used by our management committee.
That said I urge all fa…
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Regards
THBN
This is your highest high (in the Premiership years) and this is our lowest low (in the Wenger Years.)
You say you used Arsenal as an example but let's be honest with each other - you and your fellow tiny totts are obsessed with Arsenal.
Levy knows Jol has huge limitations. In approaching Ramos, Levy has tried to replace an inept potato headed liar with one of the most brilliant coaches in world football.
Not only is Ramos a master tactician but he is well-versed in working under a Comolli-esque Director of Football type character.
Jol's a nice guy who's done pretty well with £100m but don't be blinded by his huge failings.
Chelsea and Arsenal didn't knock you out of the FA and League Cups, Jol did.
On top of that, his record in games against the top 4 is appalling. Absolutely appalling. Even Pompey, Bolton and City have better records in the last 3 years.
You should all be applauding Levy for attempting to bring in Ramos, not rallying behind Jol.
secondly.. the master tactician Ramos, as you put it. Can you explain to me what he has done in the previous 18 yrs of his managerial career before having 2 good seasons with sevilla where his master tactics actaully threw away La Ligue in the last few weeks?
I am a season ticket holder at the lane and have come to realise that Jol is out of his league.
Keown,hes got a monkies head !
The fact we've spent so much money, we have a ground capacity of only 36,000 and the board seem desperate has me feeling very nervous. I only hope we aren't going to do a "Leeds" i.e. where our board have gambled money they don't have on CL qualification. It is certainly begginning to look that way for me.
I hope the figures at least add up because we still have our wage cap at abut £45K which is about 3 times less than Chelsea etc or else we might be in financial trouble.
On Arsenal, if we had of beat them to CL qualification two years ago I'd have fancied them to have real financial problems after building the new "Library". It would be interesting then to see who's got the real fickle fans!
He's had over 2 seasons and serious finance to show us just a sign of consistent resillience in defence and ruthlessness in attack on the pitch.
Instead, we stumbled - by just 2 points - into 5th place last season, blew it big time in the last game of the season before, against West Ham - all he had to do was win one lousy game, 1, that's all, to get into CL and that's after some dire results againgst other lowly teams such as Sunderland
Blew it repeatedly in cup games against Chelsea, Arsenal, Grimsby (I ask you), what more do you need to work out the writing on the wall?
He has done well for Spurs and is very likeable, but he ain't cutting at the top.
Why shouldn't the people who have provided him with the means to get so far, have questions to ask after losing to Sunderland then Everton at HOME in the season we aiming for a top four finish.
They probably thought, let's see how it goes…
You have it spot on, the board haven't got a clue in my book.
Keep the faith.
I like Jol but he has favorites. A big squad like ours cannot sustain favorites. Jol is our man but he mustn't be able to think that expectations are as low as some of his selections. Jol has blooded fewer Spurs players that have come through the system than any other manager in recent history. Lee, Daniels and now O'hara go the same way and we will never know how good they could have been.
Remember his commnets about a certain reserve team player after scoring two goal agains Everton, TWO years ago?
Deliver or sling it I say!